![[Valid RSS]](/valid-rss.png "Validate my RSS feed")
Image by ~Shanth, via Flickr
Oh, my friends. It’s never easy, trying new business ideas on the internet. But it’s always educational!
We’re a little more than a month into my six-month Podcast 2.0 experiment, and already I’m hitting roadblocks and looking for ways to flow around them. I’d like to involve you in these decisions, since without you, there’d be no show. I always respect your thoughtful opinions and ideas.
So, how are sales going?
Well, the numbers are already sobering. According to my iAmplify stats:
iAmplify keeps a healthy portion of my sales (in exchange for giving you all easy access to syncing the shows with your iTunes account), so I have earned, in total (drumroll, please)…
About sixty dollars.
…That’s $60.00 payment for producing five shows so far, with each one taking about 10 hours to create. I’m not even gonna do the math on what my hourly wage is at this point!
OK, so, I’m not freaking out yet, but it IS clear that a major course correction is needed.
Why are people not buying the downloads?
I see several of reasons, really:
• I’ve already heard resistance from many of you about how inconvenient it feels to have to create an account on iAmplify to complete your purchase. People keep asking me for two things: easy iTunes access or an option to pay with PayPal.
Well, iAmplify gives you easy iTunes access from a convenient library page (see above). Apple, unfortunately, refuses to allow audio podcsters to sell their shows directly through iTunes. You have to go through a third-party service like iAmplify.
Unfortunately, iAmplify won’t take PayPal as a payment method (I asked). I’m considering offering the shows for sale on my own online store as well, so people can use PayPal. But unfortunately, I can’t offer you the easy sync with iTunes.
(Interestingly, you have to create an account during your first purchase with any website, PayPal and iTunes included. But since we use these accounts so often, I think we forget this and it feels easier.)
Image by the_moment, via Flickr
• Secondly, there really is a “mental transaction cost” to buying even a very inexpensive thing online. (That’s Nick Szabo’s concept, not mine.) I think a lot of you are weighing the value of 99 cents against the value of your time to complete the transaction. And this weighing more often than not seems to be resulting in “I’ll just buy that later.”
(What’s really interesting is that traffic on the 126 free shows in my archive has actually increased during this period. What seems to me to be a tiny price is really just making people flow to the Free.)
Image by dougwoods, via Flickr
• Not only that, I’ve been researching online consumer behavior and learning some important things. I think Clay Shirky is mind-blowingly perceptive in saying that none of us are really “consumers” on the web. We’re users – and publishers. When we find a good piece of content, we naturally want to share it with our circles. Only, by sequestering my podcasts behind a paywall, I’m preventing you from being able to do that. So, while the show may be of high value, it’s also inherently useless to you as a user/publisher – you can’t really share it.
Image by MyEyeSees, via Flickr
I still believe in micropayments. I still believe we need a sea change in the way people value the content they get online. But clearly, we are not there yet, on either front. I know people love the podcast. I get email every week from folks who tell me how much it’s taught them or how many hours of enjoyment they’ve had from the free shows. But even with that, the psychological barrier to paying for it, it seems, is just too high for most.
If you have purchased a single download or a subscription, I want you know how much your support means to me. Thank you so much for being willing to help the show stay in production, and for voting for independent content.
Image by Karen Eliot, via Flickr
So, what’s to be done?
OK, so I can be sad about this state of affairs, or I can look for solutions. I love the show, I love making it, and I really want to continue making it. But I can’t afford to wait six months to see whether more of you might get around to purchasing downloads. The hours I’ve already spent on the show have consumed a lot of time I could have spent doing things that actually pay my rent. If I can’t find a way to make the show sustainable, I can’t make the show – and this weighs on my mind constantly.
So, I’m seriously considering going against some philosophies I’ve shared in previous posts. I’m looking at offering the show in two versions: as a free show with ads, and also as a paid download with no ads. (So, if you’re already a subscriber, nothing will change. You’ll keep getting ad-free shows, with a side of my undying gratitude.)
Image by Christopher Chan, via Flickr
With these two options in place, there’s no “mental transaction cost,” you can get and share the show freely, and there’s extra incentive for those of you who want an ad-free version. My podcast host has a decent ad program I can participate in with fairly minimal time investment.
Have I suddenly started to love advertising? No. (One thousand times no.) But at this moment, it’s an option that blends better with human internet behavior and allows me to fight for the show’s future. Even so, ads won’t begin to pay all my production costs, so I’ll likely be implementing other options in addition to this.
(If you missed it, we had a lot of discussion of various options over here.)
Image by Mr. Ush, via Flickr
Your thoughts?
So, before I take this plunge, I wanted to consult you…
• How would you feel about this program? Would you listen to the free shows, even though they contain ads?
• If you’ve already paid for the show, would you feel you were being cheated in any way by this turn of events?
• What are your thoughts on “mental transaction costs” and user-hood?
• Would you be willing to take this short demographic survey to help me find advertisers you won’t mind hearing from?
The mental transaction cost makes a lot of sense to me. I almost purchased a podcast the other day, but honestly, I just felt totally weird and wrong getting my credit card out for such a tiny cost. Anyway, I just got over myself and bought it! Good luck with your change of course.
Thank you so much, Alice! I appreciate your perspective on the mental transaction cost.
Diane, I’ve said it before, but I feel I should say it again. I think you actually need to charge MORE for your monthly podcast, and offer a discount to subscribers (much like a magazine subscription). The mental transaction cost isn’t going to change if you add advertising to a free version of the same content, which means that people will be more likely to tolerate the ads than to actually go through the motions of subscribing or purchasing an individual show.
The price increase could be as little as double… at $1.99 each, it’s still pocket change for most, and your subscription rate could be discounted to $1.49 per episode, but billed in 6-month segments. The two-dollar mark breaks down the mental transaction cost while still being affordable and getting you closer to making the project financially feasible.
You are the expert when it comes to crafty creativity and digital media like this. Let your expertise shine through. Your podcast is excellent (I even thoroughly enjoyed the subversive stitchery episode despite not thinking I would have interest in the subject matter), and you are WORTH IT.
Well, I’m open to this idea, and would appreciate some others weighing in on it. My initial thought was that iTunes, the 800-pound gorilla in the digital audio-sales market, charges 99 cents, so I’d need to be there to compete. But perhaps you’re right – since I’m effectively locked out of iTunes sales by Apple, perhaps there’s no reason to maintain this price.
I do agree that a price of $1.99, oddly, has a lower mental transaction cost than a price of .99. Weird old world we’re living in anymore, isn’t it? Anyone else have thoughts on this topic?
(haha! read some comments anyway …) If you’re going to spend more money, it’s worth more of a hassle. I know it’s weird, but I don’t mind having to jump through hoops to give someone thousands of dollars, but I don’t want to do that to spend 99 cents. You’d think it would be the other way around. And, yes, you should AT LEAST charge $2.
You’re right! And it’s so baffling to me. But it’s true – and this has been one of the most valuable threads of today’s discussion.
I have to agree here, even though it doesn’t necessarily make logical sense. There’s a “perceived higher value” that goes along with a higher-priced product.
I recently made one of my $5 patterns available through the Kindle. To celebrate, I gave it an initial price of 99 cents. I barely sold any. When I switched the price to 4.99, suddenly I had some more takers. I can only guess that people thought a 99 cent pattern couldn’t be all that good.
Pricing psychology is so wacky. I had more sales when I DOUBLED the price of my blogging ebooks, too! If I ran the world, everything would have one fair price, nothing would ever get discounted, and… well… the economy would probably collapse. :-)
I have no problem with ads, whatever it takes to keep the doors open :).
I did purchase a subscription and probably will continue to do so if it is offered– not so much to avoid ads, but as a token of support. You have consistently provided ideas, inspiration and excellent content and subscribing was a “thank you” thing :). So, to answer your question, no, I wouldn’t feel “cheated” by changing things up.
Thank you so much for your support, Sarah – of the show, and also the support you’ve given me over the years. (For years it has been!)
First off, thanks SO much for sharing this, Diane. I think it is so important for folks to see hard numbers in cases like this. Thanks for doing that.
I know it took me a while to finally get subscribed because of the simple fact that I don’t keep my wallet next to me while I’m on the computer (aside from the organizational bit about trying to keep it hung up by the door, it’s also kind of dangerous for me to have such easy access to my debit card when I’m on the Internet ;) If there had been PayPal access, I would have subscribed immediately, just ’cause it’s easy and I felt more than worth the money. That said, it still took me – what? THREE WEEKS to get subscribed! Oh the shame! Once I did subscribe, though, I realized how insanely easy it was to synch to iTunes and have it just operate like any of my podcasts. Easy. Peasy.
I get what you are saying about the sharing thing, too, though. I hadn’t thought about that part yet, but I guess I just figure if I want to share it, I can encourage folks to pay the $.99 for it!
I’m glad you are not waiting to reconsider. Your time is way too precious. Thanks for keeping the readers/listeners in the loop and asking for feedback. I hope that it’s all able to work out in a way that is beneficial for you and keeps the podcasts going, but we’ll be here to support you no matter the medium! :)
I’m glad you found it easy, Rach – iAmplify DOES offer a great service, well worth what it costs me in money and the few minutes of time it costs people to transact.
And I really appreciated you being so open with me about the barriers you felt to purchasing – that information helped me get more involved in possible solutions.
Thank you so much for supporting the show!
I’m OK with ads, it won’t affect your content, and it’s like so many other great things that I get for free, TV, radio, somebody else’s newspaper at the coffee shop. The ads help subsidize the cost…
I do think there needs to be a balanced ecology there, though, and this has always been my concern about ads. Yes, they subsidize the cost of what we consume, but how much attention do we really pay to them?
We aren’t really getting ad-supported content for free. Ostensibly, advertisers are paying for your attention when they advertise. Are they getting their money’s worth?
Diane, I just want to thank you for your continued honesty on this subject. I think the issue of being paid for your time as a podcaster, blogger, or other information sharer on the internet is such an important issue and your voice is so eloquent and strong. PS. I’m going to go pay for one of your podcasts right now :)
Thank you, Jen!
What about market penetration? I’m a crafter in Seattle, and consider myself fairly aware of the crafty world. (Ravelry member, know the local shops, go to UCU, but this is the first I’ve heard about Crafty Pod 2.0.
Maybe it’s just about more awareness for more conversion?
Well CraftyPod has been around for about six years now, and the original archive of 126 free shows still gets over 15,000 downloads a month. The free show has pretty good market penetration, but I agree with you that the newer, paid version is still making itself known. I have several marketing efforts in place now, but given the traction the original show has, these low purchase numbers seem to me to indicate something deeper than just market penetration.
That said, you’re right – marketing never hurts anything!
15, 000 a month? Girl, you rock.
:-) Another really great thing I read from Clay Shirky was this: “Fame vs. Fortune.” He says that, pre-internet, fortune was a by-product of fame, because in order to gain fame, a lot of people would have needed to pay for access to your product. But nowadays, because it’s so easy/cheap to share online content, fame and fortune have been disconnected from one another, and in many cases, are at odds. (Here’s the full post: http://www.shirky.com/writings/fame_vs_fortune.html)
Thanks for the link, as I much prefer one over the other! ;)
It’s enough that my kids think I’m famous because I’m on FB and Twitter., haha!! ;)
Well, you’re famous to me! :-)
Hi Diane,
I want to give you my honest reasons for not purchasing a show. I hope that’s okay and that you won’t judge me for my honesty!
I listen to hundreds of hours of audio each week while I work. To give you a sense, I’ve listened to every one of your free episodes, every Craftsanity episode, every Sound of Young America episode, every episode of The Moth and This American Life and The Splendid Table and Spilled Milk. The list goes on, but you get the idea.
Okay, so why didn’t I purchase the Craftypod 2.0? Here is a concrete example of my thought process when deciding to purchase an episode.
I almost purchased your episode with Lisa Congdon. I love Lisa and have met her. I follow her work closely and I’ve listened to every audio interview and watched every video interview she’s given that is available on the internet.
But that’s the thing. When your episode with her first aired I had just watched a 20 minute video of her speaking with a group of San Francisco designers. And the video was free. She was talking about her illustration practice and her book, probably a different kind of talk than the conversation she had with you.But I felt like, why pay when I just got to hear Lisa for free? Yes, it would be cool to hear Diane’s perspective on interviewing Lisa, but how different could it really be from the content I just got for free? Plus it was a video so I got to actually see Lisa while she talked.
So that’s why I haven’t purchased the episode. If it were available for free, even with ads, I would have downloaded it on first day it was available. I can just space out during the ads, or fast forward.
Those are my my thoughts. I really appreciate how open you are to sharing what is working and what’s not. You concrete example give all of us food for thought.
No judgement, Abby – it helps me to hear people’s thought processes around purchasing the show. And no matter how much we in the craft community may want it to be true, the fact of something being popular for free doesn’t automatically translate to it being popular behind a paywall.
Two things jump out at me from what you’ve shared: the notion of “I can space out on the ads and get the content for free” is fairly universal, but I do worry that we aren’t realizing, collectively, that by ignoring advertisers, we’re bringing about the death of the “benevolent engine” that actually funds most of our media for us. I don’t love advertising, as I’ve said many times before. And I’m a bit scared to rely on it as a form of monetization, because I think it’s already experiencing diminishing returns due to consumers ignoring it. So, where the heck do we go from there?
…And secondly, I think the example of This American Life is really important here. That show has long been the model I’ve followed in making my podcasts, but also, TAL has been through similar struggles with monetization. When podcasts first happened, they tried to offer their shows as podcasts only for sale. And they later switched to making a variety of paid and free options available – I suspect that even they ran into similar hurdles that I’m running into.
These are messy, messy times, but these discussions are always productive. Thanks for chiming in!
I agree with Isaac – when I was subscribing, the discount amount is so small as to be unimportant. I subscribed so that I could get your show with a single transaction rather than many. :) Offering a higher per-episode price and a bigger discount may get you a more reliable stream of subscribers. (but as you said – we’re in the wilderness here, and who knows what will actually happen!)
I know you want to keep the old episodes free, but I still think it’s reasonable to take some of them down and sell them (you have tons!). You could make bundles based on topics (a particular craft, crafty business, etc), keeping one free as a “sample” and sell the rest in a group. I’ve bought “season one” of a podcast that I liked after listening to the rest of their archives (in that case, there were around 100 free episodes with new free episodes still being produced, with the first 20 bundled for sale as “season one”).
Good luck – I’m with you hoping that there’s a way to make this work!
Thank you for your perspective, Stephanie. I’m honestly surprised by the votes for a higher price… and this is exactly why I pose questions to the excellent brains of the people who read this blog. :-)
Okay. Finally. I’ve been meaning to do it. Sorry it took me so long, Diane. But I think it’s absolutely worth the $0.99 (!!!!!!) and the tiny effort it took to get it from iAmplify. Now I’ve finally bought my first Craftypod 2.0 Episode. And I look forward to listening to it muchly!
Thank you so much, Michele – I hope you find it interesting, useful and entertaining!
I hate ads and would happily pay a higher price. My example is Pat Sloan’s enjoyable quilting podcast through Creative Talk Radio. Annoying (and using louder audio) ads are included that break the podcast into segments. I do my best to fast forward through them but would be happier not to be bothered by them at all. I should send her a note and ask her to consider offering a for-pay version without the ads.
I agree with Isaac (above) about the price. Are you familiar with the Ravelry website and community developed initially for knitters? I just checked there and saw that there were nearly 2650 patterns listed as for sale online for dishcloths. These will vary from simple one-cloth patterns to more complex design patterns and include some “sets” of patterns by theme (e.g. a holiday). I saw patterns priced at $2.00 and up to $5.00 – and I know I have paid both of those amounts and in between for these kinds of patterns. I’m guessing that $5 is today’s average price for any single, relatively basic knitting pattern as a download or a leaflet.
One good podcast (as yours always are) is worth at least that same amount. Perhaps you could offer a download file script for people who would like a hardcopy of the conversation as well as pics and links to check again later, without having to find your website or listen again to the podcast. This might help some people justify the higher price. In fact, that “hardcopy” (downloaded file with hyperlinks) would be great to have on a tablet for quick visual inspiration even when offline.
I just checked weavezine.com to see what Syne Mitchell is up to these days. My interestshifted away from weaving for a while so I stopped following her excellent blog and podcasts. Looks like she’s gone quiet for several months, but I think she is someone you might want to contact specifically about these kinds of issues and perhaps do an interview with her for a future podcast. I’d be inclined to pay you *both* to hear a conversation between the two of you.
I did finally sign up on Iamplify so I could download, individually, some of your recent podcasts. I will change that to an ongoing subscription today. By the way, I never use Itunes. I use a Microsoft Zune mp3 player and either download audio to a file then sync that to my mp3, or sometimes (for example, NPR podcasts) there is a Zune auto-signup option offered which is very nice.
As always, thanks for starting the conversation. p.s. I can’t recall, can I purchase some of your podcasts as a gift to someone else and have you issue it to them via email or something? I know a few people I think would enjoy a couple of the 2.0 ones but not sure how to go about making that happen.
Ooh, Debbie, that’s an excellent idea – I had never thought of making the show notes available as a handout. iAmplify allows me to attach a PDF to each show, so that would be so easy to do, and put the info at people’s fingertips. You rock!
Thanks for the recommendation to check with Syne – that could be an interesting show indeed.
On the gifting question, it has come up with a couple other folks. My only concern, really, is delivery. I can certainly email people the shows, but does every recipient know how to play them on their computer, or add them to iTunes? And how much tech-support time might be wrapped up in helping them? I’m weighing these options right now. I think gifting is a solid possibility… it’s all in the logistics. :-)
Hi Diane,
Wow, interesting!
Thank you for your honesty, its disheartening to see the numbers. I have not subscribed, but I have paid to listen to the podcasts. I didn’t mind setting up the iamplify account. But it did take me a while to get around to it. I wouldn’t mind if there were ads on the show. But I can understand your hesitation. I love listening to your podcasts, and want to thank you for keeping me company for many lonely hours working :) I think people are so used to getting free content there is definitely a hesitance to pay. So maybe ads are the way forward or charging more, as Isaac suggested. Either way you need to get paid for the work you do, there is no question about that. Its interesting to hear that the traffic on the archive has increased. There is no doubt that people love the content.
Thank you so much, Jane. Agreed – people do seem to like the show, based on the traffic numbers. That was what led me down this road in the first place. It’s really interesting to have this front-row seat for the evolution of consumer behavior in the internet age. Thanks for sharing your experiences with iAmplify, and thank you so much for supporting the show! I absolutely love the idea of “hanging out” with makers in their studios!
Oooooh… I know this feeling! (Albeit on a smaller scale.) I hit the same road block with my Spoon zine. I started charging $5 per digital issue and offered 1-year subscriptions. However, not having an established audience, I knew this would work against me, especially with a new, unfamiliar, hard-to-describe product. This is why I eventually went with accepting ads (which, bless my advertisers’ hearts, *maybe* paid for one day of work a month, because I couldn’t charge much without the numbers to back it). I also agree with the thoughts on not being able to share content… I think that is what I really wanted most, but it wasn’t possible with the paid format. So the ads were there, the cost was free, and my readership did go up. In the end, though, it was too much work for the payoff (among other reasons), so I closed it. Now, I have a new blog that offers basically the same type of content, just in smaller doses and on a less-stressful schedule. I think it’s my happy medium. Will I include ads? Maybe. And that’s a big maybe, with a side order of a lot of thought.
As for CraftyPod, I completely understand the buyer’s hesitation with registration versus cost. I’ve been there as a consumer/user before regarding other purchases. That said, I did subscribe to your podcast because I was already well-familiar with the show, knew it was only a one-time sign-up, and that the content and benefit in the long run was worth it. I’d have no problem with you having ads, and I wouldn’t feel cheated at all.
I do listen to one other podcast with great regularity, and they have single-show sponsors. Instead of multiple sponsors per show, which, I think, would be more easily ignored, they have only one, and that one gets a longer, verbal shout-out at the start & end of the show, and a quicker repeat upon the return from every break. Multiple mentions + show exclusivity would make it more beneficial to the advertiser and more remembered by the audience. That, I would imagine, could also warrant a premium rate charged by you for the exclusivity, especially if the sponsor is well-aligned with the show’s guest and/or subject matter. Something to chew on!
I like the single-sponsor idea, Tina – much easier for a listener to engage with than many. I’m still learning the details of the ad program I plan to participate in, but it does seem I’d have some control over the number and placement of spots.
I’m so sorry Spoonzine didn’t prosper, but I think you’ve evolved in a really smart direction with Dandyville.com, and I wish you great success with it. Audience numbers ultimately present you with a range of options for monetizing, and it really can be a struggle early on. At least with online content, you have more control over your outlay and can balance things.
Thank you for supporting the show!
Sometimes you’ve gotta do what you gotta do. I actually kind of like ads, as long as they make sense. I used to watch a craft show on Ion that constantly had commercials around it for “men’s” products. I didn’t get it, the show was mostly geared for woman who definitely don’t need those so why? Needless to say I stopped watching years ago.
Definitely, it’s those mis-targeted ads that help us to ignore them so much! (That and the overall bombardment, but that’s another story.) :-)
So many thoughts. In a hurry, so here’s a list:
1. Love the free/paid idea. People love choices. And even though you don’t love having to advertise, I think there’s a lot of businesses your listeners would love to hear from and it could be done really well.
2. Have you considered Etsy/Ebay/etc.. as platforms where people could purchase the podcast and still use Paypal? If you raised the price, this would offset their charges.
3. I think raising the price in general would be a good idea. You’re not a 3 min song, you’re a 25 min. conversation. :)
4. I think you’re competing against yourself. There’s no risk in free, and people know they can pick among them as opposed to buying an ep. and feeling like you need to like that particular ep. because you bought it. Like someone else said, I didn’t initially think I’d find the subversive stitching one very interesting and it ended up being quite the opposite- very compelling. But you only know that after taking the “risk”.
5. I would like to make money every time I tell people to raise their prices. That is all. ;)
xoxo
HAHAHA! I shall send you a check. :-)
I hear you on the perceived ease of listing on Etsy. The issue is similar to the issue of offering the shows for people to buy others as gifts. I don’t have the coding muscle to give you easy sync with iTunes. All I can do is deliver you the MP3 file. Not everyone understands how to sync this file with their device of choice, nor how to listen to it on their computers.
So the question becomes, how much tech support will I be letting myself in for, and how does THAT time get paid for? I don’t really have a desire to learn how people on Macs and PC’s, using all different kinds of web browsers, plus various smartphone and tablet devices, should be handling an MP3 file. And I worry that this is exactly what I’d be getting into. Do any of you have thoughts to offer on this topic?
I think your biggest problem is that people are lazy :-)
I don’t use iTunes. When you were producing freebies, I’d just see the post in Google Reader and the right-click on the audio file to download it and save it for later.
The extra step involved in having to visit iAmplify and pay for the episode is *just* annoying enough to make me put it off indefinitely. I did finally get around to getting the first few episodes, and then I subscribed.
Now that I’ve done that, my laziness is less of an issue, but acquiring an episode is still a departure from my usual routine. Perhaps you are having difficulty getting those creatures of habit like myself to deviate from the familiar.
I’m not sure how you can solve that issue, although selling the downloads in your own shop and accepting PayPal for them might be a step in the right direction.
I have more to say, but I just realized I’m late picking up my son, and it’s raining pretty hard out there. Oops. :-)
I agree with you, Lisa – though it may be pure information overwhelm as much as laziness. You’re absolutely right that the show needs more than one delivery method, and having an ad-supported version lets me take advantage of more of these options. And, in an environment where information is abundant enough to make everything easy, the smallest departure from routine does feel pretty huge. This is good stuff – thank you!
I just brought up some concerns I have about venturing into sales from my site on Elizabeth’s comment, so I won’t re-iterate here. But if you have thoughts on those, I’d love to hear.
…And I hope your son didn’t get wet! :-)
Hi Diane… I’m sorry to see that your six-month experiment isn’t going well.
I visited iAmplify when you first offered the new podcasts, but the only option was a subscription. I don’t like having things automatically charged to my credit card, so I didn’t get the subscription. I didn’t realize that it would be possible to just purchase individual episodes. D’OH!
So… I will now proceed to iAmplify and purchase the podcasts.
:-)
Heh! Which brings up that whole other kettle of fish: getting people in information-crowded mindsets to see the options I’m offering.
But I’m glad this post showed you there was more than one option! Thank you for supporting the show, Genevieve!
Hello Diane,
I am one of those silent users and consumers of the web who is still considering the best way to become a contributor.
I’ve been listening to your podcasts since the beginning and I’ll admit I jumped right in and looked up your new option when you announced it. But I have not listened either to the first free podcast or the fee-based ones.
What I would like to throw into the discussion here are a few ideas. The first is that I think you should treat the fee-based podcasts as a different animal than your free podcasts.
Your free podcasts allowed you to develop your voice, your format and topics. It also allowed you to produce your show without the listener making demands on you (at least demands that you had an obligation to consider). Free meant you had choices and freedom. And although that development meant the creation of a product that has marketable value, it does not necessarily translate into having built up an audience that perceives that value. Marshall McLuhan is well known for his statement “the medium is the message”. I think that idea relevant in this discussion, although I would modify the statement to say “the medium is the product”. The majority of your listeners may not have been consuming YOUR podcasts, they may have been consuming FREE podcasts.
I am not sure you can compare the download statistics of the free podcasts to the download statistics of the fee-based podcasts. I think you may have to look at the launching of your fee-based endeavours as a brand new venture. I believe you may count on a percentage of individuals that perceived the value of the content and delivery of your free podcasts but that the target market for this new product might be a different demographic. I think it may be valuable in considering the possibility that free and fee-based are two different products consumed by two different consumers.
When I downloaded the free podcasts there was no risk on my part. I listened solely for the entertainment value, maybe picking up an idea or two in the process, I might have even be informed. However, when I listen to a product I pay for I am much more involved with the product. I listen more intently and I am more engaged with the content. If I download a free pattern I don’t have to make the product. If I pay for a pattern, I have to do something with it to justify the purchase. Even if it sits on my to do list the need to justify the purchase keeps it in my field of vision. I think those relationships to free and fee-based may have some bearing on the lack of movement from your free podcasts to your fee-based ones.
So, I examined my own lack of movement. I intended to pay for and download your fee-based podcasts. Your post made me ask myself why it is I have not done so. I am aware that they are available and I don’t have any issues with the pricing. I also acknowledge that although I would have preferred to use a familiar format such as iTunes, I have no great issue with downloading from other trustworthy sources as long as the quality is still there and I can use my favourite format (iPod) to listen and store the product.
I think after working through my thoughts about this matter I conclude that I have not downloaded the product because the value has not been sold to me. I am not looking for the same podcasts that exist. I am looking for a reason to invest in the product. I would like to know where the podcasts will take me. If I buy it how will I interact with it? Will I be purchasing in-depth interviews with industry movers and shakers? Will I be educated on business practices? Will I be able to tune into informative debates? Will I learn the histories of techniques or materials of cultures? Will I receive step by step diy instructions?
The point at which I began to perceive value with the original podcasts was the moment I recognized that you were providing me with information I was not getting efficiently elsewhere. Because I have not been participating in the online craft community, I have not been forming the relationships that would have allowed me to reach the same individuals or understand the trends and movements that were shaping the world of craft that your participation does. Your observations and interactions with movers and leaders and innovators became an important source of information on trends and behaviours shaping crafty movements and craft business theory. As it is my goal to develop an online presence and business, that information was an efficient way to broaden my awareness. It has been an educational tool, a source of information.
I have concluded that your podcasts are more valuable to me if you don’t market to the demographic that consumes free. They are not interested in the same issues or concerns as I am as an entrepreneur. I want the debates, the discussion of issues in the industry and access to mentors that you have led me to in the past year. I also want to interact with the other consumers and continue the discussions you bring forward. I guess I have been waiting to see where you head with this venture.
You did an excellent job marketing your free podcasts, you created buzz. People who were not tuning in began to feel they were missing out, they tuned in. Your listeners grew. I think a marketing plan can be devised that might make this venture viable. It just might mean a hard look at who the consumer of this new product is.
As always, I am indebted to you for sharing your journey with me.
Cynthia
Cynthia, thank you so much for your very thoughtful comment! I like your idea that consumers of Free aren’t necessarily consumers of podcasts. When I started this venture, I was using a broad statistic I’ve seen in several books about online marketing: that, on average, only 1% of the audience for a free thing will turn around and pay for it. If I were seeing even 1% of the listeners for the free shows convert to paying listeners, the show would sustain. I didn’t expect to need a decimal and a lot of zeroes to the left of that 1%!
You are right; my first five years of podcast-making were compensated by learning and growth. I am, unfortunately, at a point where the trade of hours is too great for any benefits a free show might still bring me – especially, benefits in terms of passive audience.
I got a giggle out of you saying I did a good job marketing the free show! In truth, I never marketed the free show at all. I just put it out there, people shared it, and it grew. Now, you’re right – my job definitely is to create buzz about the paid shows.
I’m interested in your assertion that “the value has not been sold to me.” I’ve tried very hard in the show notes of each show to communicate exactly what value is on offer. Can you tell me more about what information is missing for you? And in terms of interaction with other podcast consumers, while I agree that would be lovely, the comments of each and every show, from the beginning, have always been available to anyone who wants to use them for discussion. I’ve found that the problem there is, people often listen to the shows away from their computers, or while doing something else. Remembering to come back and participate in online discussion is, I suspect, much the same thing as remembering to complete the iAmplify transaction.
May I also offer this perspective, in response to your concerns about value and those expressed in a few other comments here? Each time I’ve brought up this discussion of “why aren’t you willing to pay for this or that,” I do hear this same argument, expressed a hundred different ways. I think it’s basically “mental transaction costs” once again. Because buying a podcast isn’t something people do very often, it may be easier to express our resistance in terms of value concerns. I’ve heard a lot of “I’d buy it if it offered this one thing,” and “I’d be willing to do this and this to get that.” Obviously, I can’t meet everyone’s needs – they’re just too varied – and I’ve also seen that, even when I do, that doesn’t guarantee commerce will happen!
You’ve eloquently expressed that the show has brought you a lot of value over its years, and for that I am very happy. I honestly mean no disrespect in saying this, but I cannot help but wonder why a show like this can concretely help so many as a freebie, and yet be deemed less-valuable when there’s a small price attached.
I kind of agree with this in some ways.
1. I thought about downloading the free one, then thought, “This is just too much effort for me to bother now.”
2. I am a dabbler and to pay for a podcast would be an investment. I lied to myself for years that I was going to start my own craft business. I made attempts. I hated every minute of it. I finally came to the conclusion a year or so ago that I was going to stop lying to myself that I wanted to do this. Yes, it’s a waste of my talent and projects, but…since I have to run the business 100% alone without someone else doing the money stuff, and that is what utterly kills my enjoyment, it’s not happening.
Cynthia says that if you pay for a pattern, you better use it. That is so true. If I still thought I was going to start a craft business, or actually was going to, I’d pay for this because it’d be an investment. But I am a dabbler. I’m never going to do anything with it or use it as research after I’ve paid for it. The podcast now is for pros, not dabblers. I am no longer your audience. Sad but true.
I would listen to free with ads for the enjoyment, without feeling guilty about wasting the investment.
Thank you for joining the discussion, Jennifer. I do hear from people periodically, wishing the show had less to do with crafty business subjects and more to do with crafty ones. For better or worse, though I have to say that my interests really lie more in the many stories of challenge and success that come from the vast community of creative small business owners. Back in 2005, when I was doing podcasts about crafts, I very quickly found the subject matter to feel somewhat limited in the audio-only environment of a podcast. If you look at the stats (and so far, the purchase numbers, such as they are), business-related shows just have more traction than purely-crafty ones, at least for me.
But I get where you’re coming from. And there’s nothing in the world wrong with deciding to keep your hobbies for your enjoyment! Turning them into businesses really does take them away as hobbies, and this isn’t something to be taken lightly.
Ah the guilt the guilt. Registering for the free trial-episode did stop me from downloading it – some days just needing to login to an already existing acct will stop me; and I’ve been meaning to buy at least one of the episodes you’ve published but haven’t gotten around to it. I have a habit of putting off purchases, which while good for my wallet doesn’t help you at all.
To add to it, while I like the idea of podcasts, I’ve found I don’t listen to them all that much. And to boot I’ve been dealing with computer problems on my end which means I haven’t synced my ipod in like 2 months….(cue my parents’ voices, “excuses excuses”). Hm, wonder if I could purchase this directly from my ipod.
Well, you could follow the links from my web page to iAmplify on your iPod, and complete the purchase there, but I don’t think that’s the app environment you’re looking for, unfortunately. Sorry!
Hello! Thanks for sharing your thoughts, and I am sorry to hear that the sales aren’t going well. Personally the reason why I haven’t purchased any of the Podcast 2.0 (yet!) may have to do with “mental transaction costs”. I have just finished my education last week and I’m unemployed, so I feel like I should spend my money wisely…which is weird because the price of your podcasts is so low! Yet I haven’t purchased any because I just wanted to wait in order to buy one about a topic I feel more passionate about (like knitting for instance). I guess the problem with having to pay is that – as somebody else wrote above – you may find some similar content elsewhere for free – and in case your interest in the topic is just mild, you may as well not buy it, and wait to buy a podcast that strikes your curiosity a bit more. I supported the idea of paying per single episode when you first submitted your thoughts to the readers, but I realized I have not purchased any podcast.
So advertisment could be a possibility. Alternatively I also like the idea of creating “bundles” of podcasts or even series, arranged by topics, maybe with the show notes available as a handout, as somebody else suggested. I read somewhere that giving a little “extra” is a better marketing move compared to just lowering the price of your products. Hope this can help, keep up the awesome work! And pardon my English, not my first language :-) Greetings from Denmark, Valeria
Thank you for offering your perspective, Valeria. I like the bundling idea, too, but unfortunately music licensing issues make that impossible to do with the older shows. I’d have to wait until I had enough of the 2.0 shows to bundle them. Congratulations on your graduation!
Diane,
I am one of those that went all the way through until I had to create a new account, etc, to pay. I said I’d come back, and I didn’t. I wish there was a way where I didn’t have to sign up for something new to get it, and I would not mind paying more for it. I agree that 99 cents is so cheap that it might be putting people off. In my head I am thinking how do you even make more than 50 cents if I am only paying 99, and then, how does it even help if I purchase, it won’t even be a drop in the bucket, you know?
I loved the ease of just clicking on your old posts and listening to the podcast. I’d even donate some amount to be able to just do that. Like if I could send you some $ on paypal and then you could send me an email with a one-time use download link, or something. I’m not organized enough to set time aside to listen to a podcast but I will see it, click it (and if easy, purchase it) and listen to it RIGHTNOW when you post it. I also don’t like automatic charges, but would happily subscribe to a set period- 3 shows, 6 shows, etc (if I could use paypal/get a download link or something similarly easy). Also for me it is not just about signing up for a new account, it’s that paypal is where my micropayments for my self publishing go, and it feels good to be able to easily spend it to support people doing the same thing. Using my credit card feels less good, when I already have money that’s ready to be spent.
Also, I’s be totally fine with advertising. Sometimes it helps me find things I didn’t know about!
Anyway, I applaud you for trying to figure this all out and being so open about the numbers. And apologies for being too creature of habity to open more accounts.
That’s a good “drop in the bucket” perspective, Linda, thanks.
Your perspective on PayPal is a good one, too – I use mine as a similar revolving support account.
Tell me, though – if you had a download link, what would you do in order to listen to the show? I’m asking because I do have the ability to offer what you’re asking for, but as I’ve mentioned in other replies here, I’m concerned about the tech support needs it would engender. I’m not sure all internet users have the tech savvy to take an MP3 and sync it with a device or play it on their computers. Any thoughts there?
Diane! I wanted to chime in. I really agree with Linda on all counts (not surprising!) so yes, echo her.
I have been planning to buy the podcasts but honestly, they’re a “vacation”/treat thing for me and I haven’t had the time to hang out and enjoy them yet. I’m also a little daunted by iAmplify as a few others have said. What I would like to do, if this is ever possible, is to buy a year’s subscription, once, in a lump sum and have it be downloadable/delivered when it’s ready each time after that. Like a magazine. It’s so worth it, and I want it, but I am just so far beyond busy, and rarely have any time to hang out with my credit card and do a new registration thing… I think people (speaking for myself at least) are used to the convenience of iTunes, paypal platforms, etc. and that makes it quick to decide to buy and do it all in one moment. The longer experience in a day full of things you have to do and handle and answer is harder to follow through on. I’m sorry I haven’t gotten there yet but I hope you know it’s not because I don’t want the podcasts or to support your hard work. I’m just overwhelmed and want to keep things like purchases streamlined. I buy the few magazines I really want once a year and have them delivered to my house and that’s the model I like.
So yeah, like Linda, I’d like to just buy more simply, at the cost you set, and support you as immediately as possible. XOX
Also
:-) My dear, you have more than enough on your hands at the moment! Your points about ease and quickness are well-taken. I do see the wisdom of lump-sum purchases, but I also think they’re something to implement when the show has more legs under it financially. Imagine if a small group of you paid a 12-month subscription for example, and within eight months it became clear that the show won’t sustain despite my best efforts. I’m then charged with refunding balances to everyone. Not the end of the world, of course, but I suspect I should err on the side of caution until I actually have a viable thing going. But I’ll absolutely put this in my bag of future possibilities!
Hmm. I’m not sure. Generally I listen to podcasts on the computer and am not worried about syncing them with a device (I know I am probably in the minority, and would like to think that if I had said device I would know how to sync it, hah!). So, I’m not sure how you distributed your free podcast, but I just mean something like that. Or heck, a private youtube channel with the audio and you can put a picture collage of Pushkin so it qualifies as a video and I can listen to it easily (ha!). That is probably a ridiculous idea but it came to mind. ;)
Anyway, I basically would subscribe/pay to support you, and would be totally fine with ads and easy delivery method. My thought is that like most print pubs, you will probably need a mix of ads and subscribers in order to be sustainable.
Here’s a thought too. What about charging for (at least some of) the backlog? Something like making the new podcast free for X days/weeks/months (assuming hopefully it has advertising to pay you!) and then assigning a charge to certain ones after that time? Just a thought, my boyfriend listens to a lot of podcasts and apparently some people make certain back episodes “premium”/pay for episodes. You could do this with some early Craftypods and then maybe not be competing with yourself as much.
HAHAHA! Pushkin would LOVE that! :-)
That’s a really nice idea about making the older content “premium.” My podcast host offers a service for that. Once there’s a healthy catalog of shows, this could be very viable. Thanks for that idea!
As someone mentioned above, people who get free and people who buy podcasts are not always the same people. My guess is that people who buy podcasts know how to sync their devices better than most. Just a thought.
An excellent point! You’re likely right – I may be making too much of this idea.
I always like to begin by clapping and nodding when I comment here to you, Sister Diane. I am grateful for your powerful transparency about these matters. I think the conundrum of cash (and its refusal to flow) has kept many of us quiet. Since there seem to be a handful of people who’ve cracked the code and now have gobs of book deals and cooking shows and general Mass Love, it feels as though not receiving this is a sign that our content is not worth much. So–because I do believe that the quality of your content is so high, I’m encouraged to hear of your difficulties (not glad you’re having them, of course–just glad you’re willing to share them.) I didn’t, in fact, step up to commit to the podcast, even though I am a huge fan and attender-to of your ideas. I think your thoughts here about “mental transaction cost” is very telling–it speaks to my own behavior on the web. I find myself leaning forward and then refusing the final click. The ad-full to ad-free transition is actually one that has worked on me for other apps, for instance. It allows a sort of baby step. I don’t perceive at all that you are selling out or changing your stance on advertising. Because web is following the expectation model of tv (it seems to me–in terms of users expecting content that is disconnected from their payment for it), then I think ads make sense. And also, like you, I hate this. I will look forward to seeing how this continues to emerge for you. Stay the course, Sister!
:-) Thanks, Ginger! I always cringe a little when I share this stuff, but I strongly believe that these challenges are productive, and the more we discuss them, the more we might be able to hash out solutions that work for more of us. Our online community is, I’m afraid, built on inherently unsustainable foundations. I’d be sad to see it go away, so I’m always up for trying new ideas.
I think it’s fantastic of you to open up and let us know what’s going on … I’m learning a lot myself as a creative entrepreneur! I really do hope there is a way to make the podcast sustainable. It’s understandable that course correction is needed – trial and error to find the right balance!
I think it’s worth a try – to see if the free with ad option receives more downloads and subsequently sharing to spread the news. If this is also with iAmplify, you can find out if signing up for the iAmplify account is a barrier…or if it’s really the price.
I’m a subscriber to the podcast and don’t really feel cheated, because ultimately I’m paying you for the privilege of listening, I can’t judge how else you want to distribute your content :P
I honestly didn’t realize it was so hard to sell a subscription based podcast via iTunes. I’m subscribed to videocasts, where I pay for membership through Paypal…then get a special link to enter into my iTunes, then it updates automatically. I have no idea what “technology” this is… but I seriously did not think it was impossible. Bizarro! People pay for subscriptions to email newsletters… there’s got to be a way!
I like the subscription option – because that takes away the “buy it later” or “so much fuss” to get the podcasts… in fact, you could do a yearly subscription even!
Wishing you all the best in this venture!
I’d like to offer an annual subscription option, but I wanted to wait, as I had committed myself only to a six-month trial of this idea. But, if I can get it to sustainability, I’d love to do an annual one. Thanks for adding your perspective here, Linda!
I wanted to note that it does seem troublesome to go through a long process to spend a buck, but that’s why iTunes works so well. All your info is there, you just enter your password to purchase. Or if it’s a subscription, that’s a larger dollar figure, but for a long time. Reoccuring billing helps too :)
Maybe you can make this a video podcast and sell through itunes?!
Well, you are right – iTunes does allow the sale of videos. But I do wonder about trading a medium I’ve grown good at (audio) for a medium I don’t know very well (video) and then trying to charge for the results right now. :-) Video is in my future plans, though once I can clear this audio hurdle.
I just did something to check how the IAmplify “send a gift” option will work out. I used that option to purchase one of your 2.0 podcasts (the one about creative missions, loved that one) and entered a friend’s email address as the recipient. It let me add a personal message to her and choose when it should be delivered. I chose this Friday because my friend is currently traveling. She’ll let me know when/if she receives it and the ease of retrieving and listening to it on her Ipod. I’ll report back when I hear.
IAmplify does not have my credit card on file so I had to enter that information all over again. That was a little annoying but OTOH it’s probably better than yet another e_vendor storing my credit card number. Maybe that can be changed with my IAmplify account settings if I wanted to look into it.
Wow, Debbie – that is awesome! Thank you indeed for doing that test. I’ve never even seen a gifting option on iAmplify! I’m super glad to know it exists.
Here’s a partial comment with ideas as they come (if I wait to organize my thoughts, I may as well never comment):
Like many already said, I didn’t create my iAmplify account the first time because of a basic “oh crap, another account to create?” and “my credit card for 0.99$? meh”. I did overcome that reaction because I have many reasons to: first, I know Craftypod is a well produced show with quality contents, secondly, I do my best to support independent people like you in general, and thirdly, I appreciate you as a person, which makes it even more logical that I should support *your* show. But I can understand that people who don’t have those 3 reasons feel more reluctant :).
About how easy it is to sync your podcast on iTunes: I definitely appreciate that, and I do think it’s important to provide the service. And as someone who lives in SF, and for several other reasons, I may have the feeling, sometimes, that a vast majority of people owns an iDevice and listens to podcasts on it, but that may be a little… biased. I don’t remember if you asked people how (computer, device…) they listened to your podcast? Perhaps people would *really* be glad to be able to simply listen to your podcast directly on your site and pay through paypal?
About people getting to know craftypod 2.0 better: I really liked the recent reorganization of your blog when you launched it, and with my huge difficulties to launch a new reorganized version of my own site, I may not be the best person to give advice on the subject :). Still… what strikes me today is that perhaps you simply need a more classical “sales page”, “landing page”, or whatever name you want to give it? When you look at your navigation bar, the products are mixed with general informations and highlighted categories, as if it was aimed to people who already know you. So what about a page with all your products, a description, testimonials, an overview like the table of contents of the ebooks, and a link to your shop from this page? Something that shows better all the resources you have to offer, free or not? Another thing that suddenly strikes me is your “support craftypod” link: sure, if people buy one of your products, they help you pay your rent and Pushkin’s food. But when I took some of your classes, bought your ebooks, or when I listen to your podcast, giving you money wasn’t *only* supporting you. People get quality content for the money! I totally understand that you don’t want to sound like an obnoxious check-my-sales-page-I’m-a-guru-buy-my-stuff person, but between that and saying that buying your products is only supporting you?
There. I’ll still try to think further about the question, but for now, here’s my 2 cents, I hope you know that I only mean well, whatever I say :).
This is all good stuff, Veronique – thank you! I really like what you said about the three factors that made your decision to buy being fairly personal reasons. It’s so true that a feeling of personal connection is often a good motivator. And equally true that I have a lot of listeners I’ve never conversed with online or in real life, and so their barriers to buying would be different.
Your points about my blog are well-taken. This has been a work-in-progress for years now. My offerings have grown so diverse, it’s challenging to encompass them all on an easy-to-grasp sales page. But you’re right; I do need to find ways to do this.
…And your comment about “support me” vs. “here’s the value you get for your money” is really helpful. The latter is a much more powerful statement, and ultimately, plays a lot more into people’s reasons for buying anything. We buy to solve a problem or to feel good. “Support me” does’t address either of those.
Thank you indeed, my friend! (Pushkin says Hi)
I think the large number of comments already in this thread shows how invested folks are in your podcasts. I’ve already shared in an email a couple of weeks ago my personal reasons for shying away from payment, and they’ve all been mentioned here (signing up for something new, no paypal, etc.). I did finally sign up and pay for the Lisa podcast, and what I noticed is something someone else mentioned….you’re competing against yourself. Once I was done listening, I though, hmmmm….that was good. But just as good as several of the free ones that are my favorite. I couldn’t find a huge difference in value between the paid and the free. And you’re right in the idea of the publisher on the internet in that I didn’t feel as comfortable tweeting or blogging about it since it does have some hoops to go through.
There are a couple of places that offer free video/podcasts/or phonecalls as well as paid ones that have vastly different price points and sometimes very different content.
Tradeshowbootcamp is one that I paid $55 or so for 1.5 hours of listening in on a phonecall and it was totally worth it. I had received one call free as part of a giveaway, so knew the content would be good and helpful.
Artlicensing with Tara Reid is one that has some free podcast-type phone calls and others that are I think $25-$35. I’ve never paid for hers since I’ve listened to the free ones and to me, they aren’t worth the price. The free ones and the paid ones are also more-or-less the same content and format.
Both Megan Auman and Marie Forleo have smaller, shorter videos that are weekly-ish and free. But they also have larger programs for $200-$2000 and up. They bring in people with the smaller freebies and then since their content is good on the freebies, I’m more more inclined to pay a large amount for a larger perceived value.
As you can probably tell, I’m more on the business side of things and that’s what I’m looking for. Which is all to say that I think you could charge significantly more for some type of content that was different/more expanded than the freebies. I also have no issues at all with ads in the free podcasts. Best of luck figuring it all out!
Thanks, Corinna – definitely, offering “freebies” as a way to drive sales of big-commitment items is effective. My problem (and the problem of many others online) is that I started podcasting as a hobby, with no expectation of payment. Now that I want to turn it into something sustainable, those 126 free shows become quite problematic. If I leave them up, then yes, I’m totally competing against myself. If I take them down, that’s sad. I thought people who’d gained value in the past wouldn’t mind paying a little for it going forward, if they wanted the content to continue. But of course the conversation isn’t as simple as that, as evidenced by all this comment discussion.
Gah! All those comments today already? I don’t have the time to read them all, but I wish I did.
I just want to say I was planning on buying the podcasts when I had time to listen to them. In the past, when they were free, it took me months to find time to listen and I was always way behind. Same thing now.
• How would you feel about this program? Would you listen to the free shows, even though they contain ads?
I would probably pay for the ad-free versions if I didn’t have to use iTunes because I want to support you.
• If you’ve already paid for the show, would you feel you were being cheated in any way by this turn of events?
I did this with a couple of my hand sewing patterns. No one ever complained after I made them free … and I didn’t lose any friends over it.
• What are your thoughts on “mental transaction costs” and user-hood?
Agree. Creating an iAmp acct is going to suck and I’m going to mentally complain, but I’ll do it anyway. :)
• Would you be willing to take this short demographic survey to help me find advertisers you won’t mind hearing from?
Done. Also, I ended up putting my ad network ads back. No one was biting on my ads even after publishing my rates on my blog. I don’t have the time to drum up ad business and my readers aren’t the people who would advertise. Sad state of affairs. I’m still going to leave the door open to directly sell ads, but for now I need the money that comes from the networks.
xoxo!
I’m so sorry to hear your ad program hasn’t found traction yet, Alice. This really is the problem – most monetization options require a fair amount of time to create or maintain… on top of the time and cost of producing the content you were trying to monetize in the first place. :-/
Thanks for joining the discussion and taking that survey!
Some random thoughts for you:
1. I only just purchased your last podcast but that’s because I’ve been busy and not listening to podcasts for a while.
2. I also came up to the mental transaction cost – oh, no another account to try to remember the details for. But once I did get onto iAmplify I was very impressed with its set up. So thanks for showing me its there with lots of other great podcasts too! I think it is actually a good way to get quality content out by individuals.
3. Given that mental transaction cost – I would actually prefer to pay a 6 or 12 monthly fee like you do for a magazine subscription. I’ve listened to all your free podcasts so I’ll be looking out for more in the future and would be happy to pay. I also think you need to raise the overall price – $12 for an annual subscription assuming 12 episodes is almost too cheap. I don’t actually know about the psychology of pricing but I think you should value more what you have to offer – you have a high quality podcast far superior to a whole host of other crafty podcasts and if the internet content model is to actually be sustainable with actual quality people (ie/ us users / consumers) are going to have to be prepared to pay for it and what are people prepared to pay for on the internet – tangible products ie/ a book from Amazon sent to your house a song from itunes etc – or something with exclusive access implying high quality offerings: a “CraftyPod” club???? Special benefits for those who sign up for the Crafty Pod club – don’t know what you’d offer, definitely the podcasts, special tutorials, hmmm, not sure !
That’s a smart point about perceived value, Jen. And I’m officially giggling at myself now, because this is totally what I preach in my online classes – when you underprice, you’re telling people, “I don’t promise much here.” Guess I should take my own online class. :-)
Thanks for supporting the show, and for sharing your thoughts on iAmplify. It took miles of Googling to find them, but I do think they offer a valuable service.
While I haven’t read all the comments, I agree with the few I read – charging more actually feels like the sign up is worth the hassle.
I have to admit that I’m one of those people that clicked on to buy but when it came to signing up for iAmplify it put me on pause. I was in the middle of something, and having to fill out a form and go and get my credit card wasn’t something I had time for in that moment. I have always meant to go back and do so (and will in a moment actually) but decided that I’d subscribe to save the hassle next time.
I really hope that you do find a way to make this venture worth your time as the podcasts are brilliant!
Thanks, Melanie – it really is important to remember that so many of us, when we’re online, are actually doing a lot of things at once, which makes even a small interruption loom large. I really appreciate you supporting the show!
This is such a valuable discussion! I’m a newbie here, and I’m eager to buy and listen to podcasts, my issue has been time (I’ve moved a household, a storage unit, traveled several thousand miles and cared for my elderly dad in the last 10 weeks, so I haven’t had time to listen to anything! I’m streamlining– I only get two RSS feeds now – and you are 50% of that because I love your posts and want to stay connected and get more involved soon! Crazy schedules don’t last forever, and hearing your side of this makes me want to move this up on my list.
Meanwhile, a couple of thoughts:
-First, and most importantly, I love how you open up your “dance through uncharted waters” to your readers…I can’t help but feeling that you are getting close to some really good, problem-solving insight as I read through all of the experience and creativity and positive focus that has blossomed in these comments and in your responses!
-I’m intrigued with how Car Talk promotes their podcasts…you can get them free for the 2 weeks after posting if you go to their site (or get a podcast subscription), but after that those episodes are no longer free. So that makes me wonder if something along those lines could happen with your archives. I am not saying I know exactly what to do – just that this way to mix free and paid with the same podcast seems to have possibilities – particularly using the limited time free item as a way to entice folks to an action (such as visiting the website)
-As far as the tech support that you are wary of supplying … could a pdf or url to a webpage with FAQs take care of that? (with a notation that personalized help is available for a fee? Isn’t that usually $50 or $75 an hour? Maybe that mention of a fee would only serve to entice folks to read the FAQS one more time, but that’s worth it!)
- Your best solution for all of this may be pretty far outside the box. Your podcasts have value, and yes, you should be swimming in abundant remuneration! ;-) It’s also possible that your remuneration may come from something other than subscribers or advertisers- i have found that remuneration does not always travel a direct path, and it is a good thing to be open enough to let it in however it wishes to enter! as Einstein said (several times, in slightly different ways), “No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.” I often tell my students that when we paint ourselves into a corner, the only way out is “up”- we have to ascend to a new perspective!
And the way that you have invited your friends and fans to engage in this with you has created a very fertile ground that new thoughts and ideas can emerge from…
That Einstein… he was such an Einstein. :-)
Thanks for your thoughts, Meryl – you’re right; all the discussion here really has opened up some new vistas of possibility for me, and I am always so grateful for the thoughtfulness and intelligence of the people who read this blog. I hope the discussions also help all of us to better navigate this crazy online landscape.
I’m liking that “premium archive” model – there’s probably an “ad window” that’s measurable for these kinds of shows, and once a show is old enough that its traffic drops to a “long tail” level, it could easily go into a paid archive of some kind. Good stuff!
And I loved your idea of “the only way out is up.” That’s a great mantra!
I’m sorry you have had such disappointing results, but once again I admire the way you are approaching your decision-making.
I’m outing myself as a dinosaur — I haven’t downloaded any podcasts, not because I don’t value your work but because podcasts are still a foreign concept to me. I have an iPod (a gift) and can’t remember the last time i used it.
But I will say that I have no trouble with advertising, including advertising on blogs (not that you mentioned such a prospect, but nothing wrong with it in principle). Not only do I not have trouble, but I don’t ignore the advertising either. If I like a blog and see an ad that intrigues me, I will definitely check it out. And even buy. If advertising is delivered well (up to the advertiser, and how they create the ad), it can do me a service by letting me know of a product or a vendor I will like. It’s not automatically bad, and doesn’t automatically cheapen what you are doing.
Now I’m off to learn more about podcasts and what I’m missing out on. If it is of interest, let me add that I did know about your podcasts but was too lazy to learn what they are all about.
Good luck. You are doing great work, and I want to support you.
Elizabeth
Welcome to the Wonderful World of Podcasts, Elizabeth! There’s a lot of good stuff to discover. And most free shows can be listened to right from a blog page, so you don’t even have to get out that iPod. (If you click the Free Podcasts tab on this blog, you can listen to any of my old shows by simply clicking the Play button.)
Thanks for your perspectives on advertising!
So many thoughts… may be kind of random, but here they are:
I would also prefer to use Paypal, because it’s where my disposable income sits, so it’s more convenient than using my bank account. I’d prefer a simple email with a link to download the podcast. I don’t use iTunes, so all that syncing lark doesn’t matter to me. But to be honest, even if I did use it, I’d still prefer the email-with-link.
I don’t know if you need to be so worried about people knowing how to use the podcast once they’ve downloaded it. Is that really your responsibility? When you buy a car you don’t expect the car sales peeps to show you how to drive it or how to parallel park…
Although not quite the same thing as a podcast, when I sell my patterns, I don’t worry if people will know what to do with the pdf file once they receive it. Not in the sense that I don’t care whether they are able to use it, of course! But most people do know what to do with it. However, if they don’t, then I’m more than happy to help of course.
Obviously, an mp3 can be a bit more complicated. As you say, you don’t know, and can’t be expected to know, about every configuration of gadget and software. We can’t have the solution to every question that may arise from people using our products. But maybe a general guide would be an idea?
It does seem a bit lazy that a tiny thing like signing up for an account with iAmplify, is such a hurdle. It literally takes just one minute. We sign up for things all the time, why should a case like this be so much more cumbersome?
I think it’s a shame to focus on what the content is of each podcast. And for that to be the deciding factor on whether you want to pay for it or not. I’ve listened to most of the podcasts, even the ones where I didn’t really think the subject was for me – but the beauty is that there’s always been something to take away from all of them. A new idea, a fresh perspective etc. It broadens my horizon on many things. Plus it’s so well-produced which you can’t say about all podcasts! And that is well worth taking the time to create an account and pay a small fee for.
If you like it, and have listened to most, if not all, of the free ones – you know that they’re good. And apart from the fact that it’s nice to support people and products we like by paying for it, it’s also, eventually, necessary for that thing to continue to exist. Atleast in a shape that doesn’t have ads.
Maybe you could have two versions, as an experiment.
A basic free version which is supported by ads.
A paid-for version which is slightly longer (provided that it’s not too much more work), has the pdf which someone suggested and has no ads.
As for price- I think you’re right to not price your podcast for iTunes. Especially if your podcast isn’t actually available on iTunes. And if it were, maybe that would be a reason to price it higher; to set yourself apart, to stand out. If you make something by hand- say a beautiful set of hand-printed table mats, you shouldn’t try to compete on price with Walmart. Because it’s probably not the same customer.
I’d suggest $2.50 for a single episode and $1.50 per episode for subscribers.
I wouldn’t feel cheated if alongside the subscription-based podcast there was also a free ad-based one. To me, the podcast actually has more value when I’m paying for it. And not just in the monetary sense. When I’m paying for it, I do pay more attention, so I get more out of it. It’s an investment in the podcast and my continued enjoyment of it. I like the subscription, as opposed to having to remember to send you a donation.
As for people being able to share the podcast – maybe an affiliate program could have the same sort of effect?
As others have said, I really admire and appreciate that you’re being so open about this. It’s a difficult topic because, well, it’s sometimes a bit uncomfortable to talk about money. Especially how to make money. Without sounding greedy. And you could look at this and think “OMG this is a giant failure!” But it’s not. It’s a test, an experiment. Yes, it would have been nice if it had worked out a bit better. But even “failures” have their purpose. This discussion for example. Although some money in the bank would be even better!
:-)
:-) True enough – failing the money in the bank, at least there’s a really good learning opportunity. And we’re in uncharted (some would say shark-filled) waters here. All we can do is try, fail, learn, and try again. I love that we can at least discuss this stuff so productively! And I’d rather be a good example of this trial-and-error process than a false front of prosperity any day.
Many thanks for your perspectives. Since you’re also an internet content producer, you have a clear view of both sides of things. And I like the parallel you’ve drawn to PDFs. I still do a fair amount of tech support with people to get their copies of my ebooks and tutorials. But you’re right; I do need to draw meaningful lines around what’s my real responsibility there. And the theme of PayPal being a “discretionary account” for people is a strong one here.
Thank you so much for your ideas, Carina – and for supporting the show!
Wao..it seems interesting! let me think more seriously!!
well all the best dear Diane.
There are so many thoughtful comments here…
I have not purchased a new podcast, Diane, but mostly just due to time constraints on my part — no time to listen right now! But I want to support you (and I like Flattr for that) and I also would love for micro-payments to work out in the long run, but in the mean time, we all need to make money… so….
I know advertising is not your favorite option, but I think it is worth trying. You could still offer the podcast for sale (at a higher price) without ads and a free version with ads… OR you could publish ads on your site. I know that you feel that ads are ignored, but my experience actually shows the opposite. My site users say they don’t notice ads, but they do click on the ones that they are interested in and they DEFINITELY notice ones that they find distasteful! :)
Advertising can be tacky and gross, but I think it can also be a win-win situation if you can partner with the right (high quality) advertisers for your audience. For example, I would LOVE to advertise Swap-bot on CraftyPod… just an idea. :)
I’m really glad to hear you’ve had a good experience with ads on Swap-bot, Rachel. I may be picking your brain soon on that.
And yes! I would LOVE for the show to promote Swap-bot. I’ll email you later today!
I have been purchasing the podcasts and personally didn’t have a problem with any of the hurdles. I will continue to purchase and listen regardless of which direction you go from here. As a creative entrepreneur myself, I understand the value your podcast provide (tons!) and the amount of time & energy you clearly put in is worth the 3 minutes of my time to buy, the .99 cents or whatever I need to do moving forward.
What if you included 2 or more interviews but only publish once a month, include the downloadable PDFs mentioned above, and charge $4.99 (or more)?
I wish there was a way for us listeners to provide some sort of support to assist you in producing the shows. To minimize the amount of time you need to devote but still keep the quality consistent. Not sure how to go about that but I personally would be happy to contribute time. I understand that opens up a new cans of worms but maybe there is a seed of an idea in there.
Thank you for all your work over the years. Craftypod has enriched my life and I know I am not alone. Whatever the solution or course correction, I’ll be listening :)
Thank you so much, Victoria! I really appreciate your support and kind words. I also appreciate the offer of help. Definitely, i can always use suggestions for good show guests, and even suggestions of what questions you all would like me to ask them. The lion’s share of my production time is in editing the recordings. I’m not sure how to divide that up, but I’ll certainly give it some thought.
Hi Sister Diane
I’ll keep my comments short. First, I THANK YOU for giving us such quality podcasts and being willing to experiment. More importantly, thank you for sharing your process and for fostering this wealth of discussion.
Second, I’m a knitter so I listen to or watch a lot of knitting podcasts. Honestly, I actually like most of the ads I hear. I find out about new yarn companies, patterns, knit-alongs, and such. So in my mind, a quality ad is actually a positive thing that increases the value of a podcast.
So maybe here’s an idea: instead of charging for the episode, perhaps do an “along” (like a knit-alone or a sew-along), and charge for the pattern/technique/whatever. Or maybe do a fabric/yarn/pattern-a-month club that people can buy in to, and use the podcast to talk about yours and everyone else’s progress? I can think of so many things I buy because of the fact that everyone is talking about it!
Lastly, thank you again for putting yourself out there. Your willingness to share means we all learn together.
Irene
Thank you, Irene – both for the suggestion and your kind words!
I have the same comment about the price: charge more! And offer a three months, six months and yearly subscription. I live in Germany and would love to hear your podcast, but when I have to use my credit card to buy one podcast for 99 cents, I have to pay fees that are much more than 99 cents. I’m OK to pay for a good produced podcast, with a very interesting content, but I don’t want to give my money to the bank! Paypal charges fees too, but less than my bank, and on Itunes, it will be .99 euros, not .99 dollars. If I have to pay with my credit card, I would never buy for less than 30 dollars. It just don’t worth the fees.
Many thanks for that international perspective, Veronique. I’m definitely working on making a PayPal option available now.
Just a couple of different podcast models I’ve seen – one was Kevin Pollack’s video podcast. I watched a few episodes through itunes, and then reached my limit of free and everything after that was $1.99. I wonder if you could do that with your back catalog & new episodes combined? (You mentioend music licensing above, so I understand if that’s an issue with creative commons or something). But at least that way new listeners have a chance to see that they’re getting a quality product before they have to buy. In that case, all of the episodes I had downloaded were grayed out until I paid. I actually don’t like video as much as audio because I’m less likely to sit and watch something, so that didn’t provide extra value for me.
For subscriptions, you could offer different terms if the bundling isn’t easy – 2,3,6,12 months (ideally this would be for a specific selection of episodes as well, but that’s not how magazines work). I think it’s kind of about inventing a new paradigm for new media while using a language and customs that people are used to.
I think This American Life has had some amount of success through selling an app to listen to their show through on iPhones, and those listeners get extra content, although you run into the issue of people paying the fee one time and getting content for an unlimited time. The other model, which I think you’ve talked about before in discussions of Free, is using the free to point people to your paid offerings. Craftcast is one example where she does that quite a bit – she talks about classes (online and studio) that are coming up, and her guests might even tie in to those events.
Thank you Meagan! Yes, iTunes does allow the sale of videos, which is good for video-makers. I’m definitely looking at a “freemium” model where I can make certain shows available for free and then create some kind of “premium content” page where other shows could reside.
…And definitely, once this project has better financial legs under it, I’ll be able to offer more subscription terms. I’m a bit hesitant at the moment, because if the projects ends up being non-viable, I don’t want to end up with a lot of refunds to offer. But in future, definitely, I’ll hopefully be able to make a lot more options available.
Thanks for sharing these ideas!
Diane
I really have to agree with perceived value here. I have never purchased something on-line for .99. I feel like when the price is so low, none of it goes to the maker/artist/writer. I really like the idea of subscriptions and paying more for individual episodes.
Thanks, Rebecca! I have both in the works right now, and will have an update for everyone soon….
I was thinking about you and your adventures with crafty business tips monitization, and a few things occured to me, and as you have been doing trial and error and exploring the theory and psycology of the purcheses, I thought I’d pass this along in case it helped at all…
First,I agree you might be charging too little. The more inexpensive something is the less it seems you as the creator values it. Plus, as a purchaser there is no sense of exclusivity from having access to something others may not.
Secondly, there is no risk for not purchasing now. The content they pass on today will still be here later, and ergo your customer risks nothing by not purchasing. And again the excluscivity issue of anyone who comes along tomorrow will also be able to get it. Someone wanting the inside edge won’t see that edge in a continuiously available product where any of the competition will be able to learn the same things. You may want to use release cycles. Post something for a month or two and then it goes away for 2-6 months, replaced by something else.
And thirdly, have you tried asking your visitiors what they want to learn? You had 10k views. If you had added a, oh, 3 line survey for a few choices and a fill-in “other” box on a page they had to click through (and maybe gave a free how-to as a participation thank-you – you’ve made them already and it costs you nothing further in production time to re-use them like this) you’d know exactly what those 10k possible buyers want, and could create a product specifically for them.
Alternatvely, maybe you should target your audience and contact them directly. People like bloggers on the cusp of a book deal (easy to see that coming when the website goes from blogger-standard to customized and SEO’d with a domain name), or in the early post-book deal stages. I’m not sure how much help the publishers give them on brand building, audience growth, getting the 2nd book deal… People like Bakerella and her cakepops, Ruffles & Stuff with her kids clothes remakes, and so on. Reach out to your target audience directly by emailing them to offer your consulting services.
On the subject of under pricing and those 10k… 186 became buyers, so 1.86% of your viewers. That sounds small, but if you had priced something for them at $9.97 you’d have made $1854. If you are targeting your product at the interests of your customers (see the survey idea above), then you’ll have no trouble getting $9.97 from them because people will pay far more for things they are passionate about.
For a package of information – say an ebook, 6-8 video series, & project sheets to work on with each video – they would likely be willing to pay $19.97-$97.97, if not more. (Btw an online marketing guy did pricing tests, the 97 figure sells better then 99 for some reason.)
Add in 4-6 weeks access to a forum where you answer questions, and maybe a weekly Q&A conference call session for budding crafty business people and you could probably charge $97-$197. At that price you’d only need about 25 people to sign up to make $2k-$5k.
Btw, people are paying $197-$1997 for courses and coaching call sessions, so higher pricing them I suggested above does work. And the higher you price the fewer participants you need out of the 10k traffic. You don’t need a lot of buyers, you just need a few of the right buyers.
I could go on, but if you’ve already been-there and tried-that I don’t want to talk your ear off. Especially since I’m assuming you’ve seen courses like those from Eban Pagen and know about places like Third Tribe and the warrior forum and I’m repeating stuff you may know. (If not let me know and I can send you some useful links for online marketing.)
Thank you so much for taking the time to share all these ideas, Melanie! I am familiar with the Third Tribe concept/community/philosophy, and while I don’t necessarily agree with it anymore, I do agree about pricing. The prices of my podcast will increase in the new year, and I’m in the midst of creating a package of ad supported, limited-availability free content plus a premium content subscription service that definitely seems to wrap in a lot of the other ideas you’ve shared here.
I do feel compelled to say: I’m not all that interested anymore in selling consulting services, although they can be lucrative. Instead, I hope to make really good media and create ways people can feel comfortable supporting it. That’s a harder road to hike, perhaps, but there’s so much great learning to do along the way.
Thanks again!
Diane – if your podcast were available anywhere BUT iTunes, I’d love to buy it. When it was free, I could manage to download it into my Windows technology, but I can’t make the leap to buying an Apple just to hear a podcast (as favorite as yours is!)
<3
Karen
…Then I shall soon have VERY GOOD NEWS for you!! :-)